Storm the Castle B

[knightmoves]

I'm going to add "file for a clarification, and then try to build something that will accommodate either an eyebolt or an open hook (perhaps have something like a carabiner on your device, that you could use with either. Because whatever the clarification says, there's good odds that you'll show up for a tournament and the ES will have weights with eyebolts. At that point, telling them that they're illegal, and they are supposed to be open hooks probably doesn't help you, because the ES probably doesn't have the ability to fix it on the spot. So if your device can't accommodate the ES's eyebolt, about the best result you can get is to have the event thrown out / made in to a trial event, which doesn't actually help you at all.

It's a very cold kind of satisfaction if the ES tells you that you're right, but that there's no way of fixing it, so you can't compete.

[jgrischow1]

I'm going to add "file for a clarification, and then try to build something that will accommodate either an eyebolt or an open hook (perhaps have something like a carabiner on your device, that you could use with either. Because whatever the clarification says, there's good odds that you'll show up for a tournament and the ES will have weights with eyebolts. At that point, telling them that they're illegal, and they are supposed to be open hooks probably doesn't help you, because the ES probably doesn't have the ability to fix it on the spot. So if your device can't accommodate the ES's eyebolt, about the best result you can get is to have the event thrown out / made in to a trial event, which doesn't actually help you at all.

It's a very cold kind of satisfaction if the ES tells you that you're right, but that there's no way of fixing it, so you can't compete.

Good advice.

[drcubbin]

Hi everyone,

I ESed Storm the Castle for Troy Invitational this past weekend. Congratulations to Sierra Vista Red for winning the event and all the other teams that competed.

First of all, I would like to apologize for the counterweights. I neglected to read the forums and I wasn't aware of the discrepancy between the rules and the event supervisor guide on SOINC. We constructed the weights using the guide that was on the event supervisor resources page, so it used an eye bolt. Once we found out, we retrieved hooks for teams to use with no penalty to accommodate the counterweights if they chose to use them. While not the ideal solution, it worked out well for teams that chose to use it. For teams that did not use the hooks, they were able to find creative ways to attach the counterweights like cutting a length of string off of the trigger device and tying the counterweights on. This ingenuity under pressure was very impressive. If anyone is running this event and sees this, I believe National's stance is that the rules should take precedence.

The next issue that some teams had was the low ceiling height. The event was run in a wide hallway with an approximately 13ft ceiling height. Needless to say, this was not ideal for teams that could make long shots. Still, teams persevered and were able to adjust their devices on the fly to avoid the ceiling. A total of three shots hit the ceiling out of the ten shots that asked for a target distance of 10m or more. Two of them were from a team that was not able to figure out a way to adjust their device, but the other team that had hit the ceiling made modifications for a successful second shot. This shows that the team has practiced extensively with the device and I was impressed with their quick thinking.

Finally, I have two shoutouts to particular teams. First is for Kraemer Gold, who was the only team to make any shots into the bucket for the +0.3* bonus. In fact, they made it in on both counterweights. they took their time aligning their device and this earned them 2nd place in the event. The second shoutout is to The Meadowbrook School, who was the only team to use their practice logs to calibrate their device. They hit the outside of the bucket on both counterweights, which got them the +0.15* bonus and earned them 4th place. The reason that a practice log is required is to help you as a competitor! The points you earn on the log should be easy because they are things you should already be doing to prepare your device. Document all the testing you do and use that data to improve your devices. This is what separates Science Olympiad from art.

Once again, congratulations to everyone who competed. Even if you did not do as well as you hoped, it is only December! You have plenty of time and possibly more competitions to practice before your Regional tournament. Just having a device this early is an accomplishment in and of itself. Be proud of all you have done and keep working hard.
Here is the score distribution:


Tim Elnitiarta

[Flavorflav]

What size hook bolt are you getting? I assume the 1" refers to the diameter of the hook, but they are sold by the diameter of the shaft.

[drcubbin]

can we get an official interpretation of this?

The only way to get an official statement on anything is to file a request for clarification on the soinc.org website.

Although you should note that the instructions for building the PVC pipe weights say to cut 7-8cm lengths of pipe, not 7-8 inches.

And then, they are saying to cut that 7-8" piece into TWO halves. Like everyone else, we have all put out a few dollars $$$ to help with builds, but PVC comes in big lengths that run up to about $15.00. Just to come up with two really small pieces? I'm sure we could have used an empty can of peas or corn with a wire hanger as a hook. Why the major construction for this container? Or am I reading this wrong?
After viewing another trebuchet YouTube video, I see one of the teams used a 4" PVC cap that go for $7-10. Cheaper, but I still want to use my empty peas can

[Northridge]

If you want to use a different mass container to run the event, you are more than welcome to according to the rules. The key being that it fits in the 15 cm cube. I would not encourage a can with an open top, as depending on what you are using for mass in the can, it can fly out as you swing. I also would encourage if you are using this to run an in person tournament, that you send the team pictures of the mass in advance so they know what to expect.

When I run this event, I always bring zip ties along. Even if the students have an odd size hook or a weird connection point on the end of their arm, we have always been able to zip tie it on.

[spartan1516]

I saw a ratio chart on the soinc.org for the Storm the Castle Event (see table below).

I don't know exactly what it means, though. Use Counter weight 1500g for example, if the projectile weight is 60g ( tennis ball), is 7 m projectile distance the maximum theoretic distance or a average distance for reference? Is this distance calculated base on a simple Mangonel design or a sling design? It is very interesting to know the maximum projectile distance in history.

Counter weight Projectile Ratio Distance
1500 20 75 18
1500 25 60 16
1500 30 50 15
1500 35 43 12
1500 40 38 10
1500 45 33 9
1500 50 30 8
1500 55 27 7
1500 60 25 7

[mistee]

hello, my student working on this is having trouble with the part that holds the projectile. they used a toy egg and also some piece of cloth but both didn't work so far. what are some ideas they can try?

[Sppscioly]

Hi All,
Reading through the rule for Storm The Castle and it states that the counter weight cannot be modified. It does not mention anything about it's attachment other than the need to accommodate the eyebolt or J hook. So does that mean that we can through bolt through the hook or eye bolt the counter weight to the arm so that it does not swing or have other attachments on the arm to prevent the counter weight from swinging. maybe even just taping the counterweight so it doesnt swing. Technically we are not modifying the counterweight but just want to be clear that the counterweight does not have to be freely swinging. A swinging Counterweight doesn't work with our fixed fulcrum design. Thanks

[drcubbin]

I saw a ratio chart on the soinc.org for the Storm the Castle Event (see table below).

I don't know exactly what it means, though. Use Counter weight 1500g for example, if the projectile weight is 60g ( tennis ball), is 7 m projectile distance the maximum theoretic distance or a average distance for reference? Is this distance calculated base on a simple Mangonel design or a sling design? It is very interesting to know the maximum projectile distance in history.

Counter weight Projectile Ratio Distance
1500 20 75 18
1500 25 60 16
1500 30 50 15
1500 35 43 12
1500 40 38 10
1500 45 33 9
1500 50 30 8
1500 55 27 7
1500 60 25 7

We're just getting our first prototype together. I think this gives a good idea for a specific trebuchet (as well as a way to assemble a sample data table), but since each device will have different ratios of effort and load arms, I think it best to just test/document, test/calibrate, test/tweak on your specific device.